Your father was a hamster and I fart in your general direction!

bikegremlin · February 2023

SEX!

OK, now that I've, hopefully, got your attention:

I've noticed that bullying is on the rise on LES. If you haven't noticed it, that may be down to the fact that @FrankZ is the fastest gun in the West (I often just wake up, make coffee, and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up).

I'm not eager to write this, as I'm allergic to the modern "snowflake" mentality and doublespeak. However, the other extreme of bullying (no better word for it) is also something I hate to see IRL or on the Net.

Sure, we'll keep cleaning stuff up and trying to do a good job, but the forum is what we, the members make of it.

My point is:
Please don't escalate the bad stuff.
Just flag any posts you think are problematic and be patient (I'm sober only for a few hours per day, and I've got pigeons to feed). Don't respond to insults with insults.

Fooling around and the running jokes are one of the things that make LES special. Just cut some slack for the newbies, or for members who really don't appreciate it. I mean - what's the point of arguing and insults if it doesn't end with a real fight and then some rakija?!

Right now, it's far from bad, but I've noticed it getting a bit worse instead of staying the same or getting better, so hoping this might be the gram that tips the scales (may be naive, but it's worth a shot).

Just - trying to steer stuff somewhere between the LET and WHT. Y'know - to stay cool, not flip towards either of the extremes.

AuroraZero · February 2023

I apologise to anyone whom I may have offended or made it seem like I was bullying them.

Whether it was intentional or not I will make my best effort to not let happen it again.

I know my humor is a bit crass and does not appeal to everyone, so I shall tone it down.

bikegremlin · February 2023

@AuroraZero said:
I apologise to anyone whom I may have offended or made it seem like I was bullying them.

Whether it was intentional or not I will make my best effort to not let happen it again.

I know my humor is a bit crass and does not appeal to everyone, so I shall tone it down.

For what it’s worth - I don’t find your posts to be “problematic.”
Good quality humour should be preserved.

yoursunny · February 2023

It's all @Nekki and @ehab fault.

ehab · February 2023

take
off your
pants

AuroraZero · February 2023

@bikegremlin said:

@AuroraZero said:
I apologise to anyone whom I may have offended or made it seem like I was bullying them.

Whether it was intentional or not I will make my best effort to not let happen it again.

I know my humor is a bit crass and does not appeal to everyone, so I shall tone it down.

For what it’s worth - I don’t find your posts to be “problematic.”
Good quality humour should be preserved.

I appreciate that but i also realise sometimes I may come on a little too strong.

bliss · February 2023

I don't understand the essay above.
Is it composed with the same English I was taught?

shallow · February 2023

@bliss said: I don't understand

Indeed Ken.

AlwaysSkint · February 2023

@shallow said:

@bliss said: I don't understand

Indeed Ken.

Ah dinnae ken.
(I actually say this!)

vyas · February 2023

posting such titles brings shame to family

Lee · February 2023

@AlwaysSkint said: Ah dinnae ken.

Furry boots?

MichaelCee · February 2023

I BITE MY THUMB TO YOU SIR!

Nekki · February 2023

I have genuinely no idea what this refers to, and as such:

If I said something that offended you, that's your problem because I wasn't trying and you should be glad I wasn't, you pathetic little snowflake.

AuroraZero · February 2023

Jeebus @bikegremlin what the hell did you eat?

bikegremlin · February 2023

@AuroraZero said:

Jeebus @bikegremlin what the hell did you eat?

It is not "what" but "when."

shallow · February 2023

@AlwaysSkint said: Ah dinnae ken.

You ain't from Glasgow then. Must be a farmer.

shallow · February 2023

@ehab said: take
off your
pants

and jacket

AlwaysSkint · February 2023

@Lee said: Furry boots?

Lost me, there.

@shallow said:
You ain't from Glasgow then.

Was a Weegie for a year or two, as a bairn.

Lee · February 2023

@AlwaysSkint said: Lost me, there.

Fake Scotsman..

Lee · February 2023

@Nekki said: I have genuinely no idea what this refers to

Even if it was nothing to do with, still your fault.

Encoders · February 2023

i don't notice anything about this, does this happens with outcries in virmach bread lol

root · February 2023

@bikegremlin said:
the fact that @FrankZ is the fastest gun in the West (I often just wake up, make coffee, and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up).

Thanks for the insight about who runs the show behind the curtain. So far I assumed it, but now I have my confirmation. Thank you mate.

SEX!

root · February 2023

@Encoders said:
i don't notice anything about this, does this happens with outcries in virmach bread lol

No. That thread is special, because it has it's own special rules established by the gun in the west. For example spamming is allowed there.

ralf · February 2023

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

root · February 2023

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Are you implying that moderators have to justify their actions?

ralf · February 2023

@root said:

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Are you implying that moderators have to justify their actions?

No, I'm suggesting that if a post is deemed to be unsuitable and removed, it'd make sense to at least tell the poster that it was unsuitable so that they don't continue making similar posts in the future.

root · February 2023

@ralf said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Are you implying that moderators have to justify their actions?

No, I'm suggesting that if a post is deemed to be unsuitable and removed, it'd make sense to at least tell the poster that it was unsuitable so that they don't continue making similar posts in the future.

True. But this would also force the mod to explain in the message why an action was done, so you know the reasons.

selalumenang · February 2023

I'm sorry but I don't understand the title!

AlwaysSkint · February 2023

@selalumenang said: I'm sorry but I don't understand the title!

Google it, even with the misquote.

root · February 2023

@AlwaysSkint said:

@selalumenang said: I'm sorry but I don't understand the title!

Google it, even with the misquote.

It is best to avoid Google though. They could track you as a human and integrate your psychological profile into artificial intelligence to analyse your search for such title.

vyas · February 2023

MJJ will find this offensive
@dahartigan

bikegremlin · February 2023

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Yes. The idea is to achieve two things:

Keep a "written" proof for why any actions were taken (saving the infringing posts or spam causing a ban for example).
"Two heads are smarter than one" is a local saying - this lets other guys check and confirm.

Sometimes, when not 100% sure, we consult before taking any action.
Sometimes, if more drastic action is taken (bans or deletions for example), we make notes to get 2nd opinions, even if personally 100% sure it was the right call.

This makes it a bit more work, but it is an important safety measure to prevent any abuse by admins and mods.

Fritz · February 2023

@bikegremlin Agree.
Any action should be logged for our own good, improvement for staffs and members.

bikegremlin · February 2023

@ralf said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Are you implying that moderators have to justify their actions?

No, I'm suggesting that if a post is deemed to be unsuitable and removed, it'd make sense to at least tell the poster that it was unsuitable so that they don't continue making similar posts in the future.

Very often (though not always) that is the case.

We generally tend to send PM notes before any more drastic measures - giving people the benefit of the doubt and the way to make things right. Sometimes "bad posts" are a result of misunderstanding, language barriers or similar, but sometimes people are indeed spammers or dicks.

@AlwaysSkint said:

@selalumenang said: I'm sorry but I don't understand the title!

Google it, even with the misquote.

I thought everyone would get that reference!

Are grandma and spilling good at least?

bikegremlin · February 2023

@Fritz said:
@bikegremlin Agree.
Any action should be logged for our own good, improvement for staffs and members.

That policy was already established when I got the bucket & mop - and it is a good idea.

My suggestion was to introduce firing squads and public executions of spammers, but that was discarded due to budget restraints and local legislation (some countries still forbid such stuff - how they keep their population in check is beyond me)?!?

AlwaysSkint · February 2023

@bikegremlin said: Are grandma and spilling good at least?

All good; it's @Fritz that has the problem with sticks staffs.

cybertech · February 2023

its just a sign of growth. its a phase.

mikho · February 2023

@root said:

@ralf said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Are you implying that moderators have to justify their actions?

No, I'm suggesting that if a post is deemed to be unsuitable and removed, it'd make sense to at least tell the poster that it was unsuitable so that they don't continue making similar posts in the future.

True. But this would also force the mod to explain in the message why an action was done, so you know the reasons.

@ralf

If sending a private message for every post that has been removed would increase the workload on the mods/admins.
Especially if, let's say 50% of the messages turn into an argument on why the poster thinks the mod has done something wrong.
Then a public thread, and heated arguments from people who only wants to stir up more drama.

I would suggest that if you find a post removed and you REALLY want an answer to why it was removed, open a ticket in the helpdesk and hope that the mod/admin that removed your post remembers why it was removed.

mikho · February 2023

@cybertech said:
its just a sign of growth. its a phase.

Easier to stop bad behavior while growing then to try and clear the mess when it's out of control.

cybertech · February 2023

@mikho said:

@cybertech said:
its just a sign of growth. its a phase.

Easier to stop bad behavior while growing then to try and clear the mess when it's out of control.

this act of cleaning is part lf the phase too..

mikho · February 2023

@cybertech said:

@mikho said:

@cybertech said:
its just a sign of growth. its a phase.

Easier to stop bad behavior while growing then to try and clear the mess when it's out of control.

this act of cleaning is part lf the phase too..

True!

I'm glad we have a hard-working team (me excluded) that keeps this place somewhat family-friendly.

root · February 2023

@mikho said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Are you implying that moderators have to justify their actions?

No, I'm suggesting that if a post is deemed to be unsuitable and removed, it'd make sense to at least tell the poster that it was unsuitable so that they don't continue making similar posts in the future.

True. But this would also force the mod to explain in the message why an action was done, so you know the reasons.

@ralf

If sending a private message for every post that has been removed would increase the workload on the mods/admins.
Especially if, let's say 50% of the messages turn into an argument on why the poster thinks the mod has done something wrong.
Then a public thread, and heated arguments from people who only wants to stir up more drama.

I would suggest that if you find a post removed and you REALLY want an answer to why it was removed, open a ticket in the helpdesk and hope that the mod/admin that removed your post remembers why it was removed.

Isn't this like a carte blanche for mods to do whatever they want, even bend or create exceptions to rules?

mikho · February 2023

@root said:

@mikho said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Are you implying that moderators have to justify their actions?

No, I'm suggesting that if a post is deemed to be unsuitable and removed, it'd make sense to at least tell the poster that it was unsuitable so that they don't continue making similar posts in the future.

True. But this would also force the mod to explain in the message why an action was done, so you know the reasons.

@ralf

If sending a private message for every post that has been removed would increase the workload on the mods/admins.
Especially if, let's say 50% of the messages turn into an argument on why the poster thinks the mod has done something wrong.
Then a public thread, and heated arguments from people who only wants to stir up more drama.

I would suggest that if you find a post removed and you REALLY want an answer to why it was removed, open a ticket in the helpdesk and hope that the mod/admin that removed your post remembers why it was removed.

Isn't this like a carte blanche for mods to do whatever they want, even bend or create exceptions to rules?

As @bikegremlin already said, things are discussed between the mods and logged.
If there were to be a mod/admin that abused his/her powers, that person would be removed from the team.

If you ever get the feeling that this is going on, feel free to PM me or Mason and we will talk

dahartigan · February 2023

@vyas said:
MJJ will find this offensive
@dahartigan

ROFL. Back leg chickens are highly prized.

dahartigan · February 2023

On the topic of the OP, I haven't been overly active here lately due to being in more of a shitposting mood than a constructive mood. LET is the place for shitposting and being a nuisance and LES is for being a good helpful person.

Which one of you idiots ruined this lovely place?

bikegremlin · February 2023

@mikho said:

@root said:

@mikho said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@root said:

@ralf said:

@bikegremlin said: and take a look at the mod-dump section - all cleaned up

Just out of interest, if you have a post just disappear, is that what's happened to it?

I'm asking because I posted something that I thought was pretty innocuous a couple of weeks back and when I checked the thread the next morning it'd just vanished, and disappeared from the list of comments list via my profile too. If stuff does get removed like that, shouldn't we at least be told if it's infringed some rule and been culled?

Are you implying that moderators have to justify their actions?

No, I'm suggesting that if a post is deemed to be unsuitable and removed, it'd make sense to at least tell the poster that it was unsuitable so that they don't continue making similar posts in the future.

True. But this would also force the mod to explain in the message why an action was done, so you know the reasons.

@ralf

If sending a private message for every post that has been removed would increase the workload on the mods/admins.
Especially if, let's say 50% of the messages turn into an argument on why the poster thinks the mod has done something wrong.
Then a public thread, and heated arguments from people who only wants to stir up more drama.

I would suggest that if you find a post removed and you REALLY want an answer to why it was removed, open a ticket in the helpdesk and hope that the mod/admin that removed your post remembers why it was removed.

Isn't this like a carte blanche for mods to do whatever they want, even bend or create exceptions to rules?

As @bikegremlin already said, things are discussed between the mods and logged.
If there were to be a mod/admin that abused his/her powers, that person would be removed from the team.

If you ever get the feeling that this is going on, feel free to PM me or Mason and we will talk

I'd also add - based on my experience of how stuff runs (vs how it used to be run) in my country:

No amount of regulation and "transparency" can make up for having bad, corrupt people.
Similarly, if people are decent and "normal," regulations are a needless complication.
With all that in mind, people can make mistakes or turn corrupt over time, so it is good to have some checks in place.

There is no perfect solution, of course. But we're trying to hit the optimal middle ground. See what works, see what could be improved. Some people will always find moderation to be lacking - either for being too lenient ("why is this allowed?!") or for being too strict ("why was this removed?!"). As far as I can tell, the admin/mod team guys are acting with best intentions, and doing the best they can. One can't ask nor expect more from people (people can't do better than their best, they can only slack and do worse).

P.S.
As he's been called out in this thread (firstly by me), it's fair to note that @FrankZ does a huge amount of work, regularly asking for 2nd opinions for most decisions that are "big/important" (besides the regular everyday spam cleanup) - I can't thank him enough, nor ask for more.

Janevski · February 2023

Shitposting is carpetbombing the entire place while missing a target.
Usually shitposting can cause thread derailment, or thread takeover thus changing it's subject and/or keeping the said thread alive, more than it's intended lifespan.
A vigilant community member can accuse someone for offtopic.
A moderator can make the shitposter warned or banned from thread for offtopic.

Trolling is precision airstrike towards a target.
It can cause for someone to become rearhurt and offended, and/or the offending side could get a warning.
A successful troll, doesn't get warned, because he knows the safe boundaries of operation.

Fritz · February 2023

@AlwaysSkint said:

@bikegremlin said: Are grandma and spilling good at least?

All good; it's @Fritz that has the problem with sticks staffs.

The thing is we all love transparency right?
like most of the EU citizens.

AlwaysSkint · February 2023

@Fritz said: The thing is..

You missed the point; there is no plural of staff unless you mean a bunch of long sticks.

Nekki · February 2023

So if I’m understanding the thread properly, I need to absolutely ruin this place to make restore the normal order of things?

I can say I understand the logic but I’m nothing if not accommodating.

DP · February 2023

@AlwaysSkint said: You missed the point; there is no plural of staff unless you mean a bunch of long sticks.

AlwaysSkint LowEndGrammarly Plugin Enabled ✅

But seriously, didn't you have something about that in your signature some time ago?

Your father was a hamster and I fart in your general direction!

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